FAI Cup First Round- Drogheda (A)

[TenaciousDee]

A lot will be made about the fact we were held to a 9 man team, but you expect that team to abandon the original game plan and frustrate the team with 11. That leaves us with why did we play so bad when the teams were tied at 11 a piece? For all of Derry's huffing and puffing they failed register a shot on target until Akintunde's was handled on the line. We defended horrifically in the build up to their goal with most ball watching and not tracking the runners.

I have mentioned before that I am yet to see how we have improved as a team under Higgins from Decky's start, moreover in his last two games in charge. We still play too narrow. Our passing is too slow. We have no tempo or cohesion and our reliability on set pieces left and went back to Dundalk. We have to be the easiest team in the league to defend against because everyone else has a plan B at least. You can attribute it to personal on the field as usual, but with how often the team trains why can they still not make a short fast pass. That is a coaching issue, as is everything else.

[brandyball]

https://www.facebook.com/1250663236/pos ... sn=scwspmo

Drogheda perspective.

[marcoloco]

I think if Massey hadn't handled the ball on the line we would have scored.

FFS we got one of toughest away draws in the competition and we got through. Cheer up everyone

Correct. Away from home V a team that is performing better than us this season.

It wasn't pretty but its a win.

I think we're still adjusting to losing Patching and still lack quality as was shown by the squad available today.

[mickeyh]

when's the draw for the next round?

[TenaciousDee]

Tuesday evening around 6:30 on Game On.

[eugenio]

All those that don't think we need major changes....
[/quote
You mean Eugenio mostly this is becoming tedious so I’ll leave it

[eugenio]

A lot will be made about the fact we were held to a 9 man team, but you expect that team to abandon the original game plan and frustrate the team with 11. That leaves us with why did we play so bad when the teams were tied at 11 a piece? For all of Derry's huffing and puffing they failed register a shot on target until Akintunde's was handled on the line. We defended horrifically in the build up to their goal with most ball watching and not tracking the runners.

I have mentioned before that I am yet to see how we have improved as a team under Higgins from Decky's start, moreover in his last two games in charge. We still play too narrow. Our passing is too slow. We have no tempo or cohesion and our reliability on set pieces left and went back to Dundalk. We have to be the easiest team in the league to defend against because everyone else has a plan B at least. You can attribute it to personal on the field as usual, but with how often the team trains why can they still not make a short fast pass. That is a coaching issue, as is everything else.

Tenacious re short fast pass I totally agree You g Mc Laughlin did this beautifully then was subbed Failed to start ever since This piuzzles me

[Nige92]

I have mentioned before that I am yet to see how we have improved as a team under Higgins from Decky's start, moreover in his last two games in charge. We still play too narrow. Our passing is too slow. We have no tempo or cohesion and our reliability on set pieces left and went back to Dundalk. We have to be the easiest team in the league to defend against because everyone else has a plan B at least. You can attribute it to personal on the field as usual, but with how often the team trains why can they still not make a short fast pass. That is a coaching issue, as is everything else.

#HigginsOut?

I'm surprised that you don't feel that the style of play has changed since Higgins has come in. For me it has changed drastically. Now, I'm not saying we're good or that it's perfect but it's certainly different. For example, yesterday against 11 men we largely controlled the game and were on top (against a team equal/better? than us). That wouldn't have happened under Decky. We surrendered possession previously. We've been doing this throughout the season, sometimes more successfully than others.

I honestly feel our current creatue difficulties are based soley on the players we have available to us. Yesterday we had to bring on u19s. Akintunde is being asked to play false 9 or #10... that speaks volumes about the current talent we have. Personally, I think Higgins is getting the best out of this current set of players, it just ain't pretty

[magspat]

Anyone know what's the story about mcGonigle is he injured?.

[rodgers]

Pleased for Gartside saving two penalties. Can't imagine his confidence is too good at stories linking Derry with other keepers.

If squad is in need of total overhaul, not sure why the likes of Akintunde were given an extension.

Although their paths never crossed, I think if Bruna hadn't left, we might have a bit more creativity. Perhaps McEleney will help.

If I was to take a guess, I would guess maybe something covid related might have kept McGonigle out. Would still try and keep Parkhouse personally.

[TenaciousDee]

#HigginsOut?

I'm surprised that you don't feel that the style of play has changed since Higgins has come in. For me it has changed drastically. Now, I'm not saying we're good or that it's perfect but it's certainly different. For example, yesterday against 11 men we largely controlled the game and were on top (against a team equal/better? than us). That wouldn't have happened under Decky. We surrendered possession previously. We've been doing this throughout the season, sometimes more successfully than others.

I honestly feel our current creatue difficulties are based soley on the players we have available to us. Yesterday we had to bring on u19s. Akintunde is being asked to play false 9 or #10... that speaks volumes about the current talent we have. Personally, I think Higgins is getting the best out of this current set of players, it just ain't pretty

Please don't get me wrong Nige, this isn't in anyway a "Higgins out" type criticism. All I will say is that I am starting to notice more and more similarities to the previous regime and the current now that I have been to the games more regularly in person.

I think we lack shape in our formation with and without the ball, no matter the system the manager selects. When playing a wingback system, we are employing two players who can't fulfil the role of wingbacks. One is a good defender who struggles in getting up the line to provide service for the attack, whilst regularly getting caught out with a lack of support (see rovers highlights) and the other seems to have little interest in defending at all. We are pushing Danny Lafferty on every week with Ciaran Coll, who has been our most consistent player the last two years on the left side. Why is one being moved around the accommodate the other? Decky was notorious for this behaviour and was even called out about not wanting to upset certain individuals with his team selections. When Higgins dropped Lafferty at Sligo in his first game I thought this was a shift for the last manager, but here we are again. Come Saturday v Longford there will be no doubt he will start with Coll and someone will highlight that the system doesn't work.

Like the opening game of the season v Longford we started the game v Pat's with 6 defenders on the pitch, playing the wing back system and placing Darren Cole in Midfield. Since Darren's return in 2020 he seems half the player he was, yet Decky pleaded with him to return early and was accommodated at every turn, even though we had a right back sitting on the bench week in, week out (Horgan). this year we are trying to make him into a midfielder, but he doesn't have the fitness or pace to do that. We had Thomson sat on the bench v Rovers but Cole was thrown on in midfield as the game started to fall away from us. Surely a natural midfield would have assisted Jackie who was left to deal with Burke, Towell and Watts all on his lonesome as everyone else stood back and ball watched?

Our substitutions are predictable. If Darren Cole is on the bench, you could safely put your house on him being in the first wave of subs introduced no matter if we are chasing a game or trying to secure the advantage. Same goes with Fitzgerald. Yes we struggle with bodies at the moment that can do a job but Ferry and McLaughlin have shown more spark than than those thrown on more regularly and for longer periods.

You mentioned Akintunde's supposed role. Regardless of him being a fake whatever his position is, he and Junior in the last few matches have just gone wandering. Ciaron Harkin would be doing the work of 5 men across the midfield, he'll win the ball and push forward only to find that Junior and Akintunde are out of position time and time again. Say what you will about Parkhouse, but at least you knew where he was and he was willing to chase a pass down. I genuinely feel for that lad.


Sorry for the rant but this is the more common issues I find and noticed on TV yesterday too. I honestly believe we are the easiest team to defend against and we are too slow to move the ball on. People, as I pointed out, talk about the improvements we have made. Yes we picked up results but even with Patching in the team outside of Set Pieces we offered nothing. We did perform well in some games when he first came in (as mentioned) but those who performed better in the bounce are starting to fall into bad habits again and are returning to being underwhelming.

[eugenio]

#HigginsOut?

I'm surprised that you don't feel that the style of play has changed since Higgins has come in. For me it has changed drastically. Now, I'm not saying we're good or that it's perfect but it's certainly different. For example, yesterday against 11 men we largely controlled the game and were on top (against a team equal/better? than us). That wouldn't have happened under Decky. We surrendered possession previously. We've been doing this throughout the season, sometimes more successfully than others.

I honestly feel our current creatue difficulties are based soley on the players we have available to us. Yesterday we had to bring on u19s. Akintunde is being asked to play false 9 or #10... that speaks volumes about the current talent we have. Personally, I think Higgins is getting the best out of this current set of players, it just ain't pretty

Please don't get me wrong Nige, this isn't in anyway a "Higgins out" type criticism. All I will say is that I am starting to notice more and more similarities to the previous regime and the current now that I have been to the games more regularly in person.

I think we lack shape in our formation with and without the ball, no matter the system the manager selects. When playing a wingback system, we are employing two players who can't fulfil the role of wingbacks. One is a good defender who struggles in getting up the line to provide service for the attack, whilst regularly getting caught out with a lack of support (see rovers highlights) and the other seems to have little interest in defending at all. We are pushing Danny Lafferty on every week with Ciaran Coll, who has been our most consistent player the last two years on the left side. Why is one being moved around the accommodate the other? Decky was notorious for this behaviour and was even called out about not wanting to upset certain individuals with his team selections. When Higgins dropped Lafferty at Sligo in his first game I thought this was a shift for the last manager, but here we are again. Come Saturday v Longford there will be no doubt he will start with Coll and someone will highlight that the system doesn't work.

Like the opening game of the season v Longford we started the game v Pat's with 6 defenders on the pitch, playing the wing back system and placing Darren Cole in Midfield. Since Darren's return in 2020 he seems half the player he was, yet Decky pleaded with him to return early and was accommodated at every turn, even though we had a right back sitting on the bench week in, week out (Horgan). this year we are trying to make him into a midfielder, but he doesn't have the fitness or pace to do that. We had Thomson sat on the bench v Rovers but Cole was thrown on in midfield as the game started to fall away from us. Surely a natural midfield would have assisted Jackie who was left to deal with Burke, Towell and Watts all on his lonesome as everyone else stood back and ball watched?

Our substitutions are predictable. If Darren Cole is on the bench, you could safely put your house on him being in the first wave of subs introduced no matter if we are chasing a game or trying to secure the advantage. Same goes with Fitzgerald. Yes we struggle with bodies at the moment that can do a job but Ferry and McLaughlin have shown more spark than than those thrown on more regularly and for longer periods.

You mentioned Akintunde's supposed role. Regardless of him being a fake whatever his position is, he and Junior in the last few matches have just gone wandering. Ciaron Harkin would be doing the work of 5 men across the midfield, he'll win the ball and push forward only to find that Junior and Akintunde are out of position time and time again. Say what you will about Parkhouse, but at least you knew where he was and he was willing to chase a pass down. I genuinely feel for that lad.


Sorry for the rant but this is the more common issues I find and noticed on TV yesterday too. I honestly believe we are the easiest team to defend against and we are too slow to move the ball on. People, as I pointed out, talk about the improvements we have made. Yes we picked up results but even with Patching in the team outside of Set Pieces we offered nothing. We did perform well in some games when he first came in (as mentioned) but those who performed better in the bounce are starting to fall into bad habits again and are returning to being underwhelming.

This post sums up every single thing I feel and not only feel but am concerned about
we def seem more and more AGAIN like Deccie headless chickens lately . Harkin is being slaughtered by lazy b….s around doing little Boyce too sold out time and time again by same tactics ? I use this word with trepidation now for I actually see NO tactics
3 PLAYERS MUST BE SHOWN THE DOOR AT ONCE and I’m not looking wholesale changes just get rid of those who are so OBVIOUSLY totally useless or heartless or both and get the Mc Laughlins etc in now a cup defeat and the season is another write off

[Nige92]

Dee

The HigginsOut jibe was tongue in cheek, I don't think any right minded person would think that

I hear what you're saying but I would disagree on a couple of points. Regarding the team shape, I think defensively we have a really good shape. For the most part we are a very difficult side to play against and difficult to break down. We don't give away too many chances per game from what I see.

Offensively I have less clarity on what we're trying to do. It has changed since Patching left for sure, it's become more difficult for us. I put this largely down to personale. Our midfield is very light and at the moment doesn't possess a player that can dictate a game.

With the Coll/Lafferty situation I think he's trying to get two of his better players on the pitch together. You get Laffertys attacking ability, and Colls defensive ability. Both of them make us a more solid team. I know Lafferty has come in for stick but I'm my opinion he's one of our better players.

With Boyce it's interesting, he's got a few goals but in open play he doesn't offer a whole lot going forward from what I've seen. As you say, he's nearly shy of overlapping and going down the line. Now I have a feeling he's being asked to hold his position so the Lafferty can play higher up on his side. I don't feel it's fair to say they can't fulfil the role without knowing what they're being asked to do.

Regarding Cole I think it's a matter of being a senior player and by default gets selected. I know we want to see the young players come on but we have to remember they're only young lads and they're only really playing out of necessity. The manager has to manage the squad and there's no doubt that seniority plays a role at times. I think Cole played over Thomson v Shams because of a discipline issue to be fair.

What I will say is that Higgins has a more progressive style and with better players that will become more obvious and effective. At the minute he's playing a system to suit the players at his disposal, to cover weakness and get the most out of them. I don't believe it's the one he'll want to play in future when more talent is available to him but it's a slow process (slower than we'd like) but in my opinion I'm hopeful for better things. Under Decky last season it was absolutely brutal.

[dcfc_jp_1989]

#HigginsOut?

I'm surprised that you don't feel that the style of play has changed since Higgins has come in. For me it has changed drastically. Now, I'm not saying we're good or that it's perfect but it's certainly different. For example, yesterday against 11 men we largely controlled the game and were on top (against a team equal/better? than us). That wouldn't have happened under Decky. We surrendered possession previously. We've been doing this throughout the season, sometimes more successfully than others.

I honestly feel our current creatue difficulties are based soley on the players we have available to us. Yesterday we had to bring on u19s. Akintunde is being asked to play false 9 or #10... that speaks volumes about the current talent we have. Personally, I think Higgins is getting the best out of this current set of players, it just ain't pretty

Please don't get me wrong Nige, this isn't in anyway a "Higgins out" type criticism. All I will say is that I am starting to notice more and more similarities to the previous regime and the current now that I have been to the games more regularly in person.

I think we lack shape in our formation with and without the ball, no matter the system the manager selects. When playing a wingback system, we are employing two players who can't fulfil the role of wingbacks. One is a good defender who struggles in getting up the line to provide service for the attack, whilst regularly getting caught out with a lack of support (see rovers highlights) and the other seems to have little interest in defending at all. We are pushing Danny Lafferty on every week with Ciaran Coll, who has been our most consistent player the last two years on the left side. Why is one being moved around the accommodate the other? Decky was notorious for this behaviour and was even called out about not wanting to upset certain individuals with his team selections. When Higgins dropped Lafferty at Sligo in his first game I thought this was a shift for the last manager, but here we are again. Come Saturday v Longford there will be no doubt he will start with Coll and someone will highlight that the system doesn't work.

Like the opening game of the season v Longford we started the game v Pat's with 6 defenders on the pitch, playing the wing back system and placing Darren Cole in Midfield. Since Darren's return in 2020 he seems half the player he was, yet Decky pleaded with him to return early and was accommodated at every turn, even though we had a right back sitting on the bench week in, week out (Horgan). this year we are trying to make him into a midfielder, but he doesn't have the fitness or pace to do that. We had Thomson sat on the bench v Rovers but Cole was thrown on in midfield as the game started to fall away from us. Surely a natural midfield would have assisted Jackie who was left to deal with Burke, Towell and Watts all on his lonesome as everyone else stood back and ball watched?

Our substitutions are predictable. If Darren Cole is on the bench, you could safely put your house on him being in the first wave of subs introduced no matter if we are chasing a game or trying to secure the advantage. Same goes with Fitzgerald. Yes we struggle with bodies at the moment that can do a job but Ferry and McLaughlin have shown more spark than than those thrown on more regularly and for longer periods.

You mentioned Akintunde's supposed role. Regardless of him being a fake whatever his position is, he and Junior in the last few matches have just gone wandering. Ciaron Harkin would be doing the work of 5 men across the midfield, he'll win the ball and push forward only to find that Junior and Akintunde are out of position time and time again. Say what you will about Parkhouse, but at least you knew where he was and he was willing to chase a pass down. I genuinely feel for that lad.


Sorry for the rant but this is the more common issues I find and noticed on TV yesterday too. I honestly believe we are the easiest team to defend against and we are too slow to move the ball on. People, as I pointed out, talk about the improvements we have made. Yes we picked up results but even with Patching in the team outside of Set Pieces we offered nothing. We did perform well in some games when he first came in (as mentioned) but those who performed better in the bounce are starting to fall into bad habits again and are returning to being underwhelming.

He's had one window & still working with a bulk of players that he didn't sign, when he took over we were bottom of the league with just 2pts; lost his most creative player because a loan spell ended. I think Higgins is doing the best he can with this group of players, he'll know himself who'll he want to keep long term & what he'll need to bring in. Rome wasn't built in a day & I think we just need to patient as a fanbase & settle for a respectable finish this season considering the start we had & let Higgins put his own team together over the winter & then see where are at this time next season

[stevebradley]

Rome wasn't built in a day & I think we just need to patient as a fanbase & settle for a respectable finish this season considering the start we had & let Higgins put his own team together over the winter & then see where are at this time next season

This is the key bit for me.

I wasn't convinced when Higgins was appointed, as it felt like the usual case of DCFC just reaching for someone we knew. But I'm prepared to give him a chance.

We've had too much chopping and changing re managers over the years, and need a period of stability and consistency now. Look at Stephen Bradley at Rovers, who would have been sacked seasons ago if it had been Derry. Took him a while to start delivering, but he undeniably has done since he found his stride.

We need to give Higgins time to build his own team and see where it can take us. POD is giving him 3 years (including this one) to win the league, which I think is far too unrealistic. But at least he's being given a few seasons to make his mark.

[TenaciousDee]

What I will say is that Higgins has a more progressive style and with better players that will become more obvious and effective. At the minute he's playing a system to suit the players at his disposal, to cover weakness and get the most out of them. I don't believe it's the one he'll want to play in future when more talent is available to him but it's a slow process (slower than we'd like) but in my opinion I'm hopeful for better things. Under Decky last season it was absolutely brutal.

First of all Nige, thank you for the reply.

I have asked in several threads and in conversations for someone to explain to me how our style of play has changed in the managerial transition and you are the first to not come out with the usual cliches, you actually explained your viewpoint. Thanks again.

I am not expecting overnight success, no-one should. We know he is stuck with players that are not fit for purpose and most were signed and sold to us as "they can also play (INSERT POSITION) if required". Dogs on the street knew what we needed in, but we went defensive and made excuses for the poor recruitment process. If you need a creative midfielder, don't sign a defender that you want to double up for that position "if required".

You did say that we are a hard team to break down, last few games that has not rung true. In the last 3 at least we have been the creators of our downfall. Drogheda game, everyone stopped playing as they went on the attack and no-one looked around to see where Corcoran was. Rovers, they targeted Boyce once they identified that neither Fitzgerald, Akintunde or Junior were tracking back to cover the space behind Ronan once they sucked him into committing himself to a challenge. With the wing back system, this seems to cause a vulnerability such as what I mentioned previously. Fitzgerald doesn't seem to know where he is playing, whilst the other two just float around dropping to look for the ball. This either pulls a midfielder away from his position, or he is reluctant to move to support the wingback as Toal or Coll track the centre. Pat's, similar to the Drogs goal conceded. I think analysing these goals and correcting it in training is what needs to be done, and is the best course of action to address all the other areas on the field.

[eugenio]

All the jargon eg “wing backs’.. “Tucking in ‘,,,,,’giving width ‘,,,etc etc is just that …. jargon ..
if a player is absolutely useless no jargon will excuse that …if he is lazy …..ditto … if he is done.. ditto Why play these players just because they are on the books that’s what’s wrong we have at least in the squad 4 absolute tubes who are slaughtering Coll. Boyce Jackie now even our 2 brillant c backs
Forget the jargon just leave them out they are never going to do any better CUT THEM OUTNOW