Brandywell Stadium Development

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rodgers
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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by rodgers »

Andy, Steve

Unfortunately I think you are both right. It really is a sad indictment of the Council that millions and millions of public money has been spent on the Brandywell and yet it still probably can't host events like this which would be of benefit to the NW as a whole.

As I have said before, the redevelopment was an opportunity to provide a showpiece venue for the number 1 sport in this area. Instead, what we have is increasingly resembling a glorified Bishop's Field (no disrespect to the Bishie).

The championships will require 6 host venues. Tallaght (Dublin) and Windsor (Belfast) would be venues for sure and possibly Turner's Cross (Cork) would be next. But after that the options are thin on the ground (assuming Thomond isn't selected as it is a rugby ground). Lansdowne is far too big and Dalymount won't be ready. It's depressing but predictable that at least one of those can't be found in Derry, the next biggest city on the island.

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barry
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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by barry »

rodgers wrote:Andy, Steve

Unfortunately I think you are both right. It really is a sad indictment of the Council that millions and millions of public money has been spent on the Brandywell and yet it still probably can't host events like this which would be of benefit to the NW as a whole.

As I have said before, the redevelopment was an opportunity to provide a showpiece venue for the number 1 sport in this area. Instead, what we have is increasingly resembling a glorified Bishop's Field (no disrespect to the Bishie).

The championships will require 6 host venues. Tallaght (Dublin) and Windsor (Belfast) would be venues for sure and possibly Turner's Cross (Cork) would be next. But after that the options are thin on the ground (assuming Thomond isn't selected as it is a rugby ground). Lansdowne is far too big and Dalymount won't be ready. It's depressing but predictable that at least one of those can't be found in Derry, the next biggest city on the island.
Venues probably will be:
Aviva
Windsors
Tallaght
Turners cross

They a choice from Terryland, Sligo, coleraine & Ballymena showgrounnds, Brandywell.

rodgers
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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by rodgers »

It appears this may be a done deal. If our 'CEO' wasn't a nincompoop, this is precisely the type of thing he should be lobbying on.

The chairman could also use his political clout with Leo to lobby.

These decisions are largely made in backroom but can result in large amounts of money being dished out.

If we capitalised properly on this, I think this is the only way in which we will ever see the Brandywell completed.
Last edited by rodgers on Wed Oct 31, 2018 3:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

marcoloco
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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by marcoloco »

barry wrote:
rodgers wrote:Andy, Steve

Unfortunately I think you are both right. It really is a sad indictment of the Council that millions and millions of public money has been spent on the Brandywell and yet it still probably can't host events like this which would be of benefit to the NW as a whole.

As I have said before, the redevelopment was an opportunity to provide a showpiece venue for the number 1 sport in this area. Instead, what we have is increasingly resembling a glorified Bishop's Field (no disrespect to the Bishie).

The championships will require 6 host venues. Tallaght (Dublin) and Windsor (Belfast) would be venues for sure and possibly Turner's Cross (Cork) would be next. But after that the options are thin on the ground (assuming Thomond isn't selected as it is a rugby ground). Lansdowne is far too big and Dalymount won't be ready. It's depressing but predictable that at least one of those can't be found in Derry, the next biggest city on the island.
Venues probably will be:
Aviva
Windsors
Tallaght
Turners cross

They a choice from Terryland, Sligo, coleraine & Ballymena showgrounnds, Brandywell.

If its a joint bid NI will expect more than 1 venue...

So Winsor plus 1... when you consider it like that Derry would be a reasonable choice if you forget about our FAI league allegience and consider it geographically. Could work for or against us depending on which basis is considered.

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by stevebradley »

marcoloco wrote:
barry wrote:
rodgers wrote:Andy, Steve

Unfortunately I think you are both right. It really is a sad indictment of the Council that millions and millions of public money has been spent on the Brandywell and yet it still probably can't host events like this which would be of benefit to the NW as a whole.

As I have said before, the redevelopment was an opportunity to provide a showpiece venue for the number 1 sport in this area. Instead, what we have is increasingly resembling a glorified Bishop's Field (no disrespect to the Bishie).

The championships will require 6 host venues. Tallaght (Dublin) and Windsor (Belfast) would be venues for sure and possibly Turner's Cross (Cork) would be next. But after that the options are thin on the ground (assuming Thomond isn't selected as it is a rugby ground). Lansdowne is far too big and Dalymount won't be ready. It's depressing but predictable that at least one of those can't be found in Derry, the next biggest city on the island.
Venues probably will be:
Aviva
Windsors
Tallaght
Turners cross

They a choice from Terryland, Sligo, coleraine & Ballymena showgrounnds, Brandywell.

If its a joint bid NI will expect more than 1 venue...

So Winsor plus 1... when you consider it like that Derry would be a reasonable choice if you forget about our FAI league allegience and consider it geographically. Could work for or against us depending on which basis is considered.
Would UEFA want a tournament on a plastic pitch though ?

What's the best Irish League stadium outside of Belfast - Ballymena ? Larne ? Shamrock Park used to get used for U21 NI games, but I don't know what it's like these days.

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by rodgers »

stevebradley wrote: Would UEFA want a tournament on a plastic pitch though ?

What's the best Irish League stadium outside of Belfast - Ballymena ? Larne ? Shamrock Park used to get used for U21 NI games, but I don't know what it's like these days.
I just had a look at the Wikipedia page for the 2019 tournament in Italy. One of the six venues is an artificial pitch.

Whether the pitch installed by the Council is as good might be different issue.

Not 100 per cent sure on second question. At the moment I would have thought Ballymena but by a few years time Larne's ground might well be the second best and that they would be in pole position to be a venue. I would guess Larne's owner would be lobbying a lot for it if he could promise to make the upgrades in time. He has already said he wants to bring Champions League music to Inver Park so the ambition is there. And I'm sure he could persuade some public money to be spent helping it along.

Derry would be left behind again!

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by KEVK »

Whilst some were fooled by the new 'world class facility' to begin with, a lot of us could see from the start that the Council had done a shit job of the Brandywell.

As time goes by, we will all start to see how shit the Brandywell truly is in an overall 'stadium' context when it won't be considered for international events like this.

Just because there is one decent stand with swanky toilets doesn't make it a great 'stadium' - there's plenty more boxes to tick for that and they can't even tick the media facilities box at the moment.

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by TenaciousDee »

The formal bid will be submitted to UEFA next year with a decision expected in early 2020. While venues will be finalised as part of the bid process, matches could be played at the Aviva Stadium, the National Football Stadium at Windsor Park, the redeveloped Dalymount Park, Ballymena Showgrounds, Tallaght Stadium and Turner’s Cross. 

The Irish Rugby Football Union has also confirmed that Thomond Park in Limerick and Kingspan Stadium in Belfast can also be used as potential venues in any bid.

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by KEVK »

TenaciousDee wrote:
The formal bid will be submitted to UEFA next year with a decision expected in early 2020. While venues will be finalised as part of the bid process, matches could be played at the Aviva Stadium, the National Football Stadium at Windsor Park, the redeveloped Dalymount Park, Ballymena Showgrounds, Tallaght Stadium and Turner’s Cross. 

The Irish Rugby Football Union has also confirmed that Thomond Park in Limerick and Kingspan Stadium in Belfast can also be used as potential venues in any bid.
So a stock car racing stadium is ahead of us?

I really hope the local media/journalists can use this to start asking the Council questions around what really is the plan with the Brandywell? Not just from a Derry City perspective, but as rate payers and the ability to host future events on a national and international scale.

We know they are waiting on funding to complete the next phase, but with the amount of money that has already been spent, did the Council get value for money? Surely it should be already be up to a standard where it can be considered for these events?

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by marcoloco »

What's the capacity in Ballymena?

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by Keyser Soze »

No mention of the Brandywell?

We're out then. No surprise.

rodgers
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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by rodgers »

I think the Council and the club really need to start putting a bit of pressure on this for many of the reasons KEVK says. What will visiting international teams make of Ballymena ffs?

Rugby venues should really be discouraged as well, particularly any that are the subject of upgrades. The tournament should be focussed on leaving a legacy and lasting improvements behind in the form of improved domestic football grounds and it would be a bit of a joke if the IFA and FAI pushed for a UEFA tournament to be used in a way which left rugby stadiums in better shape!

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by marcoloco »

Keyser Soze wrote:No mention of the Brandywell?

We're out then. No surprise.
But why include Brandywell?

Its too small (2,900 seats), the main stand is unfinished, it does not meet basic requirements (toilets, wifi, journalists) no infrastructure to get here (from around the Country)... if your honest with yourself including the Brandywell would weaken any bid.


Ballymena Showgrounds -

"In 2010 the Warden Street stand was redeveloped to all-seater standard with a new capacity of 2,200 seats. The stadium now holds 4,100 spectators, but is limited to 3,600 due to health and safety".

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by Phillipb »

marcoloco wrote:
Keyser Soze wrote:No mention of the Brandywell?

We're out then. No surprise.
But why include Brandywell?

Its too small (2,900 seats), the main stand is unfinished, it does not meet basic requirements (toilets, wifi, journalists) no infrastructure to get here (from around the Country)... if your honest with yourself including the Brandywell would weaken any bid.


Ballymena Showgrounds -

"In 2010 the Warden Street stand was redeveloped to all-seater standard with a new capacity of 2,200 seats. The stadium now holds 4,100 spectators, but is limited to 3,600 due to health and safety".
Who wants to use a ground where the toilets are in a tin hut.

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by stevebradley »

marcoloco wrote:
Keyser Soze wrote:No mention of the Brandywell?

We're out then. No surprise.
But why include Brandywell?

Its too small (2,900 seats), the main stand is unfinished, it does not meet basic requirements (toilets, wifi, journalists) no infrastructure to get here (from around the Country)... if your honest with yourself including the Brandywell would weaken any bid.


Ballymena Showgrounds -

"In 2010 the Warden Street stand was redeveloped to all-seater standard with a new capacity of 2,200 seats. The stadium now holds 4,100 spectators, but is limited to 3,600 due to health and safety".
By 2023 the vast majority of the A6 to Belfast will be dual carriageway or motorway.

The A5 improvements will be under way, with the section to Strabane possibly completed.

We'll have a new £27m EU-funded railway 'transport hub' in the city.

We've been promised Stormont funding to finish the Mark Farren stand off - which would include toilets etc underneath them. And being included in this tournament would in-effect guarantee that work would happen.

Things like the wifi and journalists desks at the Brandywell are hardly substantive problems and can be easily fixed. Sure Dalymount isn't even built ffs !

So tell me again why Derry isn't on the list ?

The only reason I can think of is the 'small p' politics of it all. The FAI don't think of us as one of theirs, and nor do the IFA - who are very conscious of the fact that Brandywell is viewed as a League of Ireland stadium. So which of those two associations was going to push for us to be included ? Neither. Belfast was always going to be used, so with only 1 other NI venue likely the IFA would predictably have done all they could to ensure it was an Irish league stadium. That's the sad outcome of the limbo status we have within football on the island. Not to mention the fact that the IFA and everyone else in Belfast can't see west of the Bann anyway.

It could well be time to dust off the 'Derry for 2023' campaign stuff from the rugby world cup bid, and put it to good use again on this issue.

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by marcoloco »

"By 2023 the vast majority of the A6 to Belfast will be dual carriageway or motorway.

The A5 improvements will be under way, with the section to Strabane possibly completed.

We'll have a new £27m EU-funded railway 'transport hub' in the city.

We've been promised Stormont funding to finish the Mark Farren stand off - which would include toilets etc underneath them. And being included in this tournament would in-effect guarantee that work would happen..."

Steve you are an optimist!


By 2023 we're now deep into Brexit...

Outside Investment in NI will be confined to Belfast (more so than ever before...)

The A6 will be complete in parts only...

A5 will still be on the drawing board with ROI and NI/UK waiting on the other to start works...

Magee will still be making their business case for more students...

The nursing collage will have been mothballed...

The Maritime Museum will have been delayed further...

And our 'multi model transport hub' will comprise a refurbed station building with trains serving Belfast alone... with no rail halt serving the airport

The Brandywell will be unchanged to how you see it today...

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by danny hale »

Maybe no grass is a big hint !?

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by TenaciousDee »

Sinn Fein has published a press release and Elisha McCallion is looking fir answers as to why the region is missing out.

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by KEVK »

TenaciousDee wrote:Sinn Fein has published a press release and Elisha McCallion is looking fir answers as to why the region is missing out.
Quote from Raymond McCartney on Facebook:

"The stadium as it sits now is ready for this type of tournament. Capacity, facilities etc, as Philip Devlin(facebook poster) has suggested pitch could be issue, but it is something we need to explore."

Glad that Sinn Fein are looking for answers on this and will be asking questions, but I really hope Elisha and Raymond do their research and find out what the stadium criteria is for the tournament before jumping the gun and crying that Derry is being screwed over.

Based on Raymond's statement, I'm not convinced they have done their research as I would be shocked if the stadium would be ready in its current state. It's not the Foyle Cup..........

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Re: Brandywell Stadium Development

Post by doll »

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_stadium_categories

If the tournament is to be held in Cat 3 or 4 stadiums we are short in capacity amongst other things.

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